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Post by manche on Apr 13, 2013 17:25:25 GMT -5
I was surprised that this episode was not here. This is the best episode of the whole TV series in my opinion. The most interesting plot, the good and freaky enemy, a lot of emotions are here. The dissapearences of all members of the crew, it was very emotional, with exception of the dissapearance of Firouz, it was a bit out of frame, I did not notice his dissapearance for the first time, until the moment, when Doubar said it. When I watched this episode for the first time, I was afraid that Sinbad will be looking for the new crew. And I almost forgot, this episode was very important for the relationship between Maeve and Sinbad. The scene with the kiss was great and the surprise of the rest of the crew was greatly done, especially their expressions.
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Post by Doubar on Apr 13, 2013 18:04:54 GMT -5
Oh gosh, you're right. We didn't even have a thread for this one. xD But it's true, "Village Vanishes" is a very interesting ep. I always thought the plot to be pretty good, not only but also because it showed the characters's ties. We were able to see how much Dermott's disappearing affected Maeve, how devastated Firouz was after Rongar's vanishing. Not to mention Doubar and Sinbad and their wonderful moment as brothers.  Also, things weren't clear right from the start. Usually you were always able to tell who's the bad guy the moment you saw him/her, but I remember not having suspected Milasko right away. And that's a good thing imo. And of course the famous kiss. I just loved (and still love) to see the crews' reaction to it. ;D *ponders* True that. He just vanished together with the last remaining villagers, didn't he? Good grief, it must have really been just a side-note if I don't even remember anymore. >.> |
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Post by manche on Apr 14, 2013 10:30:47 GMT -5
The unnoticed dissapearance of Firouz could have been the director's intention. He maybe wanted to show the helplessness of the characters to do something with the situation. He was simply there in one minute and the next minute was gone.
And I must agree with the identity of the villian. I suspected Belkor at first, that he had a connection with the events. I suspected Milasco later, that he brought the curse into the village but without any intention. We heard about the existence of Vorgon in the middle of the episode and his existence was not sure after the scene with "killed" Milasco. The final explanation was given in the last ten minutes.
This episode was one of the most emotional episodes in whole TV series. It showed the strong bond among all members of the crew. This is one of the reasons, why I love the first season.
And the crew's reaction to the kiss between Maeve and Sinbad was really great. Doubar looked surprised in a pleasant way, Firouz looked completely confused and I am not sure, what Rongar was thinking at this moment.
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Post by Doubar on Apr 14, 2013 14:28:59 GMT -5
Now that could well be true indeed, that Firouz' sudden disappearance was even an intended move. Or it's just due to each ep having just a limited time in which things can be shown. So maybe they had to make a cut at some point. Anyhow. So you first suspected Belkor? Awesome, because I did, too. ;D He just behaved suspiciously, what with his obvious hostility and all. And then later, I did indeed think Milasko to have brought it to the village unintentionally... the scriptwriters and Milasko's actor really did a good job there in fooling the viewer. So indeed, plotwise this was a fab ep. Same here. I, too, missed that a lot during S2. In S1 we were shown the crew's ties much more often or it was just more obvious than in the second one, I'm not sure. Apart from some eps in which the crew really worked as one again, I feel like Sinbad's mainly been in the focus of things in S2. It's one of the things I really pitied, because one of the elements that make AoS be such a lovely show is the friendship between the main characters and how they form what can only be called a family. As for the crew's reaction towards the kiss: Aw, yeah, they were all thoroughly astounded. Doubar seemed rather contemplative to me, as if he was just realizing that Sinbad might not just have a crush on the Lass, but that there was actually more to it. Or, alternatively, he just realized that it wasn't just one-sided but that Maeve actually reciprocated. Firouz on the other hand... I don't think he saw that coming. Haha, he looks so baffled... it's a real joy to see his face. xD And Rongar... yeah, he looks rather sceptical, doesn't he? Maybe he's not quite sure that instant whether the two of them making out is such a good idea. I mean, he's only been with the crew for some months at that point of time, and he doesn't know Sinbad as well as Firouz and Doubar do. So maybe he was looking at things a bit more neutrally, thinking of how much trouble a relationship could bring to a ship and crew. *shrugs* |
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Post by manche on Apr 14, 2013 14:42:31 GMT -5
Yes, They probably needed to make the development of the events a little faster, this was probably the reason for the scene with the effort of Maeve to create the hole into the wall. Until this scene, people dissapeared one after another. This was the opportunity to let people disappear faster.
And the motif with Belkor was great. He looked as a typical villian at the beginning of the episode, but he showed as the good guy at the end. And the role of the villian did not miss him in the second season.
And I agree in the connection with the ties among the crew in the both seasons. The second season was too much centred to Sinbad and Bryn in my opinion. The dynamics of the crew was disturbed by leaving of Maeve. The rest of crew did not have so much room in some episodes. And Maeve had natural chemistry with all crew and this ability I completely missed by Bryn.
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Post by Doubar on Apr 14, 2013 15:01:37 GMT -5
Yup, I think you're right with the wall-scene: it was a perfect excuse to get poeple to vanish faster. I mean, just like you said - until then they disappeared one by one, but when Maeve was trying to break through they vanished in dozens. And totally agree with you on Belkor! That was such a great move with him turning out to be the good guy in fact. Really love it when a show/ep or movie sets the viewers on a wrong track before offering the truth. That's my impression as well - that the focus lay a tad bit too much on Sinbad and Bryn. Though the mean thing about the latter was that Sinbad behaved really awful in tha regard, considering how often he showed interest in other women while Bryn was clearly showing affection for him. Ah, but that's a different matter altogether. Bottom line is that yes, the crew's dynamics was different in S2. Not necessarily because Maeve was missing, but in general. I think it's also due to the different atmosphere, which was much darker in general. Everything was just more serious and there was less space for the crew as a whole. I completely agree with you on Maeve though. She had a natural chemistry with the crew, while Bryn seemed to be mostly focused on Sinbad. I guess that's also reasoned by her being rather calm and contemplative in contrast to Maeve who was pretty outgoing and had quite a temperament at times. But still it's a pity really. The brunette holds so much potential as a character imo but only little of that was put to use. |
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Post by manche on Apr 14, 2013 15:19:36 GMT -5
Maybe you are right, that the whole change of dynamics was not depended on the Maeve's departure only, but also on the complete change of the atmosphere of this Tv series.
The change of Sinbad in the typical sailor with a woman in every port was the next thing, which I did not like in the second season. I also was not pleased with the usage of redshirts in whole second season. It started in the first episode and continued it the whole season. This phenomenon was not used in the first season almost. In the majority of these cases these redshirts have not a different purpose than being killed by the hand of a villian.
And one question to this episode. I have never clearly understood the scene with Maeve, Sinbad and Milasco in the forest, where the branches attacked them. Were they aimed at Maeve for her knowledge of magic? Or Vorgon tried to pretend the attack at himself? And how is possible, that our trio was able to leave the village, where the wall was completely around?
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Post by manche on Apr 17, 2013 4:13:55 GMT -5
I must correct my note about one of the most emotional episodes. This was the best emotional episode of whole Tv series.
Maybe the relationship between Maeve and Sinbad was described even better in the final episode of the first season, but from a global scale, this episode was full of great emotions from the beginning until the end:
Maeve and Doubar's support of Sinbad decision at the beginning of the episode.
Rongar's sadness that he was selected for testing of Firouz's invention
Maeve was very deeply hurt by the loss of Dermott and the effort to Sinbad give her support
Firouz was destroyed the disappearance of Rongar.
A desperate trying of Maeve save all people, which worsened the situation.
A great scene between brothers, their best scene together with the events in the episode The beast of Basra.
Sinbad's desperation when he lost entire crew.
And the final scene of Maeve and Sinbad, not only their kiss, but also their last talk. All with the assistance of the rest of the crew, of course.
It is a little shame, that there was no room for expressing some emotions after the dissapearance of Firouz. We can understand it in the connection with the length of the episode, but the rest of the crew got this possibility. But it is only a small blemish of the entire episode.
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Post by Doubar on Apr 17, 2013 12:53:39 GMT -5
*nods* I think all those things really added to the different dynamics and increased the discrepancy between S1 and S2. Sinbad's new attitude really wasn't helpful either. Especially as most of those random women were also far from being interesting characters. Or at least that's what I, personally, think.  Wow, I didn't even notice they used red shirts so frequently in S2. But indeed, the only red shirts that I *do* remember are to be found in that season. When I think of S1 none really comes to mind. But then again, there weren't as many deaths in S1 anyway. So maybe that's also why. Haha, actually, I wondered about that, too. It seems illogical. xD Seriously, I don't know what the purpose of that was. I can only guess that the Vorgon feared Maeve might be powerful enough to really trouble him and thus he wanted to get rid of her, just to be sure. I don't think though that they were really outside the wall. Most likely they were just walking an area where the wall left some space to the last building. . Nice observations about all those emotional moments there. It's indeed a real pity that Firouz didn't get a part in this as well. But still, even despite the inventor just vanishing, this was indeed the one ep that showed the ties within the crew the best. |
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Post by manche on Apr 18, 2013 1:53:28 GMT -5
Firouz got a certain form of compensation, without the usage of his invention Sinbad would not have been able to defeat Vorgon. So Vorgon's defeat was the common work of Sinbad and Firouz. And Maeve helped a bit, without her advice Sinbad would not have known that the sunlight is deadly for Vorgon.
And Sinbad's chicken in the second season were not interesting, none of them for me. None of then had a bit of Maeve's charm and beauty, I do not mention the fact that her character was much more interesting.
And the redshirts, I hate it mostly for the reason, that in almost no episode was the reason for their presence. The rest of the crew did not need them. For example the first episode. Sinbad was able to save Bryn without troubles alone, after getting out from the lake with the water dragon. Three sailors died here unnecessarily. They could have kept alive the last crewman Jakar at least. It looked ridiculously. He stopped swimming in the middle of the lake and he was waiting for eating by the dragon?
And the next problem, which you mentioned was the lack of emotions. I want to talk again about the first episode. The crew lost one of their members. And Sinbad was the only one who showed some emotions. Maybe I am wrong, but I do not remember many emotions from the side of Doubar, Firouz or Rongar. I thought, that they liked her. And any of them never mentioned her name again after this episode. They also lost next three sailors, but it did not matter, the most important thing is that they found Bryn? I know, that they were only minor characters...
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Post by manche on Apr 19, 2013 14:26:28 GMT -5
And the final idea with the Firouz's invention was interesting. When I watched for the first time, I thought: "How can Sinbad kill him? Vorgon is immortal!" Vorgon could have won if he had waited until the complete sunset. Do you think that Sinbad had a next plan for such a case?
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Post by Doubar on Apr 22, 2013 13:33:21 GMT -5
Hum, true that about Firouz' invention. But it's not like Sinbad thanked him for it afterwards, so I'm not sure if it's a real compensation indeed. I sure have no idea though why the Vorgon was so impatient. Had he waited till the sun was down completely, Sinbad would have been lost. On the other hand... it's not like the Vorgon had any idea about the device, so with the mountains having already cast a shadow on the village he must have felt pretty safe. Honestly? No. I mean, what could he have done? Vorgon wouldn't have let him kill himself, and Vorgon was pretty much indestructible. Unless Sinbad had managed to indeed end his own life despite the Vorgon being keen on not letting that happen, there would hardly have been anything else to do. As for the ladies of S2: Aye, same here. Deanna (that druid/wicca) was the only one who was remotely interesting - but as a character and not Sinbad's fling. But then the same can be said about pretty much every minor character there was in S2. The first season had so many great chars - Rumina, Talya (God, of course, Talya, she was great!), Turhan, Caipra, Khalel, even Casib to some extent ... while Uruk, Zora and Mala are pretty much the only persons who I would list as interesting during S2. Really? I don't even recall them anymore. xD But then again, like I said, I didn't watch S2 even half as often as I did S1, and even with S1 I'm forgetting about a whole lot of things. It does sound somewhat familiar though - the crewman who just stops swimming, obviously waiting to be eaten so that the viewer could go a little more "oooh noez... they really are in trouble".  Aye, the only one who also showed emotion was Doubar. But that was more aimed on Sinbad - he seemed to feel bad for the younger one. Sinbad was in distress because of Maeve and Doubar was sorry because of that. Which is kinda ridiculous because we know Maeve was pretty much like a little sister to him - he never voiced that, but considering he said that he'd risk his own life to keep Maeve from harm (The Trickster) that's what we have to assume. And the other boys really liked the Celt, too, so yeah... it was odd right from the start. |
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Post by manche on Apr 22, 2013 14:06:32 GMT -5
But he probably knew about this device, he saw it in action. Maybe he thought that the only person who can work with it is Firouz and he was gone.
If the purpose of this was making the scene more suspenseful, it was not done very well. The shore must have been very close (Rongar was ashore during a few seconds) and without any reason Jakar stopped swimming and he only shouted at Rongar: "Please, Pull me"
I have never thought about the friendship between Maeve and Doubar from this side, but it sounds very well. He really looked there that he regrets Sinbad more. (The thing with risking of the own life, I think that Doubar would do this thing for anyone from the crew.) And Firouz and Rongar's attitudes were even worse, any interest about her fate.
Characters were really more interesting in the first season. Except the people, who are mentioned above for example: Omar, his advisors, Eyolf, Vincenzo, Goz, Mustapha, Aleana, Serandib, Trickster, Belkor, Aptor, Plunkett... From the second season I would think, except the people who you mentioned, about Velda.
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Post by Doubar on Apr 23, 2013 7:38:40 GMT -5
Did he really see it in action? I'm not sure anymore whether he was around at that time. But if he was, then aye, he should have known. >.> Or he did indeed think that Firouz was the only one capable of using it. As weird a thinking as that would be. >.> Hahaha, but yeah, I grant you that. The building up suspension with Jakar becoming a red shirt didn't really work. It never really did with any of them because you knew after five seconds who was gonna come back and who wouldn't. xP As for Doubar and Maeve: Yeah, that's right. He'd probably risk his life for any of the crew. Still, intentionally done or not, the way he said it to Maeve made me think that he feels more towards her than that she's just a friend (but not in a romantic way of course!). I felt like he's always been a bit protective of her - as soon as he accepted her onboard anyway - what with him coming to her help in battle ("The Rescue" and "The Ronin") although she didn't necessarily need it. He wasn't like that with the guys and I don't think he did it just because she was a woman... maybe it's just me but I always thought he liked her like the little sister he never had. And in this regard his reactions were sad, but true - Rongar's and Firouz' were much worse. Last but not least concerning interesting chars: Ooh, right. I forgot to mention Velda. Now she was lovely indeed, and with her we got to know a bit more about Firouz (and if it was just that he actually had an almost-girlfriend ^^).  But in general, yeah, I think S2 lacked interesting minor chars. |
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Post by manche on Apr 23, 2013 9:22:10 GMT -5
The Ronin is a good example of his effort to protect her, he was afraid of her. The scene when his head appeared in the tent was very nice, very nice was the scene when he followed her after her leaving of the camp. He maybe thought about her as a little sister. It is really strange, that he had not more feelings for her after her dissapearance. His friendship with Bryn was different, I had suspicion that he had some romantic feelings for her.
The friendship between Maeve, Firouz and Rongar was decribed very well. It is horrible, that the writers did not give an opportunity to them express some feelings after her dissapearance. It looked that they did not care about her. We know that it is not truth. In the comparison with it i did not see any big connection between Bryn, Firouz and Rongar. Bryn had a connection with Sinbad and Doubar, but I do not remember many scenes where was shown her connection with Firouz and Rongar.
The thing with Vorgon. He was there, when Firouz demonstrated his invention. He probably thought that this device can not defeat him or that Firouz is only person who is able to work with it.
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But in general, yeah, I think S2 lacked interesting minor chars.