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Post by Bryn on Mar 13, 2012 6:19:30 GMT -5
Aww thanks fireland that really means a lot. I'm both a s/b and s/m fan. But I love the idea of Maeve and bryn being friend
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Fireland
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Post by Fireland on Mar 13, 2012 10:02:54 GMT -5
Hehe, I could never be a B/S fan, but I was definitely a B/D fan (either Doubar or Dermott, once he would have turned into a man). I really couldn't imagine anything to happen between her and Sinbad. Again, I'll have to watch the s2 soon if I want to keep writing my fics (I want them to be coherent to the storyline). Maybe I'll see things I haven't noticed back then, but I don't think they had a romantic relationship involved.
And as of Maeve and Bryn's personality, it's easy to imagine their personality could clash ... just like it's easy to imagine they would rather complete each other. And that's the latter that I want to explore in my fanfics, because we've seen already that fiery personalities didn't match well with Maeve's, even if she acknowledges their skills (Sariya at first in the Goul's tale, Talia, the Norseman's chief), while with softer personalities, it appealed to her (Serendib, Gaia, Eeyolf, Jullaner in Monument, etc.). That's why I think Maeve and Bryn would have made an interesting team.
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Post by Doubar on Mar 13, 2012 16:06:08 GMT -5
alex: *loves the idea as well* @fire: Oh sorry, I missed on the edited part of your post. But anyway, I totally agree with you. I think Bryn had such a hard time being accepted by the fandom because of the way the character was brought into the show. Back then the fandom was dominated by M/S fans (naturally) so having a new female character join the show and seemingly replace Maeve in every aspect was bound to be a problem. Anyhow. I do have to partly disagree on the "no romantic relationship" part I think. Having re-watched almost all of S2 now I am certain that Bryn had a crush on Sinbad. And that this is really his fault. There are these tiny gestures here and there, looks and such that suggest Sinbad is interested in her, however it's different from what he used to be like with Maeve and if I might add my two cents in this I would say that if it hadn't been for the bracelet and the fact that she was part of his crew she might have well ended up as another "catch of the week" for him. However, the mentioned things do let him stay somewhat decent with her which is also why their relationship seems to float between sibling-like friends and lovers-to-be. Or at least this is the impression I got. *shrugs* To be honest, I for one could (although I must confess I think I couldn't really ship them either ... too much of a M/S and B/D shipper for that *blush*). But that would require Sinbad to become decent again and let the past be bygone. I think did he come to terms with what happened in "The Sacrifice", the S2 Sinbad and Bryn would actually make a good couple. Not an exciting one like M/S were, but a good one. More down-to-earth in a way, and more like any everyday-life couple would be, but lovely nevertheless. And somehow I guess this is also what the real innuendo of Hell House was (i.e. come to terms with the past and start anew - maybe even with a new pairing i.e. S/B; and after all everyone knew Jacky was not going to come back). If we don't take this into account however, and just concentrade on S2 Sinbad as he was, their "relationship" was nothing but dysfunctional, with Sinbad obviously not caring the least bit for Bryn's feelings as soon as they would reach a romantic level (-> all the smooching infront of her eyes; and even bringing a woman onboard the ship for obvious reasons). Which again, in my eyes, lead to Bryn not fully giving in to her crush, but trying to stay on the friendship-level with him (which is also why I think we get to see only so few jealous looks of her). So yeah, when taking S2 as what it was I do see why you can't imagine it. And I agree with you. Aya, I realized that, too. And it sounds sensible, too. A fiery personality like Maeve would need a calm counterpart that is no "threat" to her, but rather completes her.
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Fireland
Seaman
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Post by Fireland on Mar 13, 2012 16:40:18 GMT -5
If I take it from the ''producers'' point of view (ex.: the message underlying Hell House and such), I would most likely agree with you. There could have been something happening in the season 3, if there would have been one. But then again, only if Sinbad would have started on a new path. It was well known throughout the fandom that the Sinbad from S3 would have been the happy medium between the s1 and s2 character, and only in this context would I have imagined something to happen with Bryn. Especially since at that point, it would have been 2 years or more that Maeve was gone, and of course I wouldn't picture Sinbad staying single for the rest of his life, waiting for her. So The Hell House was another step into his grief: - Denial, check - Anger, check. - Sadness, bargaining, depression, check. - Acceptance ... somehow. Then season 3 could have brought him closer to Bryn once he started acting more normal, again. However, season 3 never happened. So this scenario is as virtual as the one implying Maeve to be back. Again, from the producers point of view (and Jacqueline's), she wouldn't. But that has more to do with the negociations behind the camera than the storyline, per se. Hell House is obvious in its way, when it shows us just how much Sinbad still cared and ached about Maeve, how he chose her before his crew, etc. I think this is why even though the fandom knew Maeve would never be back, there are dozens and dozens of fanfics telling about her return, because where the serie really stopped (the real serie and not the virtual episodes involving the alien plot that were never to be produced) it still lead us to believe Sinbad still had very strong feelings for Maeve. In this regard, I really don't like the idea of Bryn being there to pick up the pieces, either. It's not something any woman would like to do in a love relationship, and most of the time, that kind of relationship just can't work because it is poisonous. For them to be involved in a relationship they (mostly Sinbad) would have to truly feel Maeve is history, which is really not the case in Hell House. My opinion, again it might change when I re-watch the serie. I'll try to comment in the appropriate section
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Post by Doubar on Mar 13, 2012 17:20:03 GMT -5
Nothing more for me to say other than: you wrapped that up really nicely. That's exactly how I see it, too.
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Post by manche on May 13, 2013 10:02:49 GMT -5
I really hated this episode when i have seen it for the first time. I was angry, that Maeve was separated from the rest of the crew, I did not want to see the next episode and I had the strong aversion to Bryn. My attitude has changed during years, but I do not still like this episode much.
The plot was not interesting for me, it remind me of King Kong, uninteresting villians.
The lack of interest about the fate of Maeve from the side of her friends, with the exception of Sinbad. All of them has good relation to her but there it looked that they do not care about her at all.
Unnecessary death of three sailors. Sinbad did not need anyone for the rescue of Bryn in the end and it looked that they longs for death literally. They could have done it a better way, they could have shown some effort to save themselves at least.
Positive moments were the emotions of Sinbad towards Maeve at the beginning and the end of the episode, the reunition Sinbad with the rest of the crew in the forest and the introduction of Bryn. I like the final scene with Dim Dym, because I was afraid that Maeve is dead until this moment, for the first time I did not concentrate on the plot too much I was thinking about the fate of Maeve. And the final line of Sinbad was nice: "we meet again, Maeve." I hoped in it so much.
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Post by manche on May 16, 2013 3:14:46 GMT -5
Aww thanks fireland that really means a lot. I'm both a s/b and s/m fan. But I love the idea of Maeve and bryn being friend I completely agree with you, I hoped that their characters will meet one day and they will become friends, unfortunately this did not happen.
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Firouz
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Post by Firouz on May 25, 2013 21:44:13 GMT -5
In terms for season three, Maeve was supposed to stay in Basra with Caipra for 6 weeks (6 episodes) to learn more and grow stronger. Sinbad and Doubar were to talk and he admits Rumina is alive and how he knows there is a connection between Rumina, Dermott, and Maeve are, but then they get attacked by some kind of monster where Firouz and ROngar, who are in town buying supplies, have to go after them, Firouz was supposed to meet Zelda in different situation (so that didn't change much) On another island on their return to pick up Maeve, they were to go to an island where a powerful white magical sorceress is and see her talk with Dermott. She alludes to the fact that he is more than he seems, but for his own protection she can't speak of it. Whilst there they are involved in a 'witch-hunt' and have to save the white-healer from getting her head chopped of by a scared and bigoted king. Once back in Basra, they arrive in time to see Maeve and Caipra taken hostage for being KNOWN magicals and taken to Omar for punishment. Since Omar was fooled by magic, abet evil and dark, he assumes all is bad and any who practice are either kick-off or killed off. Sinbad and the crew arrive in time to save the day. Then they meet with Rumina again. She doesn't know her father is alive yet and they fight. Maeve is able to put up quite the battle. Sinbad gets wounded and makes Maeve lose all control and blasts Rumina and burns her quite badly. Rumina, would be angry and scared because this is the first time Maeve would have been seen in her eyes as equal, and vanishes. Maeve would then have to use her magic to stabilize Sinbad whilst waiting for Dermott to go get the others and let Firouz tend to him. Next ep was to be Rumina attacking Maeve and forcing her to be trapped in her nightmares. Sinbad would then go in and witness her entire past in which he'd have to assure her that all is well and that they'd destroy Rumina and bring Dermott back. That's as far as I got in reading the possibles for season 3. I do know that had the show continued, those same plots would have been used with Bryn instead of Maeve, and more alien influences would have be involved too. Like...I mean....aliens taking human form as elders and guides...IE, Caipra anyone?
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Post by Doubar on May 26, 2013 7:19:07 GMT -5
@firouz: O.o Either my memory fails me completely now or you never told us! Seriously, I didn't know a S3 with Maeve had been fleshed out like this already. I only knew of the nightmares thing and of that Maeve was supposed to stay at Caipra's for a couple of eps. But the Sinbad getting hurt plot and Maeve losing all control, and Velda having a re-appreance (how awesome would that have been?!)... that's completely new to me. Also, I am astounded there's no second sorceress in this. Didn't our Caipra once say that a new female character was supposed to join and accompany the crew while Maeve was in Basra? Or was that more of a funny thought that had never really made it past being a stray idea? Lol, it's funny really. I've been actively involved in the fandom for aslong as the board exists and still I am learning new stuff. That's quite awesome. ^^ On another note though: As for the aliens taking on human form... seriously? But didn't Naha say the aliens were dragon-shaped and hunted down by nights or something along those lines? And that the elders and guides were the humans they entrusted with leadership over their own race - meaning Bryn, Sinbad and Tetsu were born to be leaders to the race of men. Along with other poeple who, who would have thought?, bore resemblence to great personalities like Ghandi or Mother Teresa... But actually I even prefer the idea of superior beings taking human form. And the thought that DimDim and Caipra might be two of them... now that's pretty cool. I like it (though I would still prefer them NOT to be aliens!). manche: I know what you mean. I felt pretty much the same, and at first had a strong aversion against Bryn. But that mellowed over the years and by now I really love her as a char. Still, I must admit that I, too, think they could have done more with what they had at hand: Bryn is such a fascinating person, she could have been introduced as who she is: lovely, strong, just basically a great woman instead of being the damsel in distress. I mean, I know she wasn't a real damsel in distress because she didn't give in after all and she wasn't afraid either... but nevertheless I would have wanted for something else. She's mysterious what with her lost past and her bracelet, so why not introduce her in a mysterious way? But maybe I only think like that because of how I see Bryn.
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Firouz
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Post by Firouz on May 26, 2013 11:33:18 GMT -5
Er, I meant season 2 sorry! Slip of the finger!
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Firouz
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Post by Firouz on May 26, 2013 11:34:58 GMT -5
It had been discussed that it could have gone either way with the aliens...
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Post by Doubar on May 26, 2013 13:06:55 GMT -5
Er, I meant season 2 sorry! Lol, I didn't even notice you accidently wrote S3. I knew what you meant and even copied the mistake as you can see. xD
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Post by hannibal on May 27, 2013 14:45:12 GMT -5
@firouz: Wow, first time i hear about that plot for season 2!! That would have made a very good season 2!! Too bad the producers found it too much "disney-like"...
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Post by Eleana on Sept 1, 2013 20:07:27 GMT -5
I didn't know about those plot ideas for season 2 ! It would have been great... --- The only thing I like in this episode in how sad and twisted Sinbad is in the end when he realize that Maeve's gone and that he never got the chance to tell her how much he cares. It speak volume at how much she means to him. What is funny is how the dubbing let us believe other things... I remember watching season two in english and been completely dissapointed when Sinbad says : « Never had the chance to say goodbye, Maeve. Say how much I care. » because in the french version (FV), he speak of love not only care... which is not the same... « Je n'aurai même pas pu dire au revoir à Maeve, ni lui dire combien je l'aime » (http://www.dailymotion.com/embed/video/x5tml3?start=400) In the FV, DimDim's voice is the same as in the first season. But anyway I don't like much the voices they used in the FV... OV are always better
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Post by Doubar on Sept 2, 2013 3:02:43 GMT -5
@eleana: Aw, I can well understand how disappointed you must've been when you first heard the original lines. And I must say, I do prefer your dubbing over the original there. ;D In our dubbing they translated this into something in between (I'll just give you the translation of that back into English): "Say how much she meant to me." It neither talks of love per se, but it makes it obvious that he cared deeply - more than you probably would for a friend. Ha, and in your dubbing DimDim's voice was the same also? Over here, too. I was totally shocked when I watched the original and the purple orb's voice was all unrecognizable. O.o It was the moment I understood where all those "Maeve never really was with DimDim, it's all been just a trick" fics came from. I never thought of something like that because in our dubbing, the orb clearly bore DimDim's voice.
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